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Main - Bug Box

Rules not working properly?

By Nicko
9/27/2016 8:14 pm
I recently changed my defensive gameplan and added quite a few rules. I added the play "Nickel Strong FS CB3 Blitz" to my playbook as well. This play is not set to be used in any of my rules, yet this play has been repeatedly called when a rule should be used instead. I've been checking my rules and gameplan over and over trying to find what may be causing this, but I am completely lost. This play was called in situations where I had an active rule(s), and this play wasn't even in my regular defensive gameplan(for that situation).

I have several overlapping rules, and multiple rules for certain situations. Does this cause rules to not work properly? I thought that if multiple rules apply, they will "combine" the odds together.

Here's the times it was called, when as far as I can tell, it shouldn't of been called.
https://mfn2.myfootballnow.com/gamecenter/view/5034#925646
https://mfn2.myfootballnow.com/gamecenter/view/5034#925648
https://mfn2.myfootballnow.com/gamecenter/view/5034#925577
https://mfn2.myfootballnow.com/gamecenter/view/5034#925589
https://private75.myfootballnow.com/gamecenter/view/70#14412
https://private75.myfootballnow.com/gamecenter/view/70#14444
https://private75.myfootballnow.com/gamecenter/view/70#14463

Thanks for your time, and sorry for the inconvenience.

Re: Rules not working properly?

By punisher
9/27/2016 9:26 pm
Nicko wrote:
I recently changed my defensive gameplan and added quite a few rules. I added the play "Nickel Strong FS CB3 Blitz" to my playbook as well. This play is not set to be used in any of my rules, yet this play has been repeatedly called when a rule should be used instead. I've been checking my rules and gameplan over and over trying to find what may be causing this, but I am completely lost. This play was called in situations where I had an active rule(s), and this play wasn't even in my regular defensive gameplan(for that situation).


what it might be is you dont have plays on those rules so thats why that Nickel Strong FS CB3 Blitz is popping up like it is .

if i remember correctly is once you make a RULE and go to the VIEW PLAYS for it it will tell you if you dont have a play for that rule it will select a play for that rule when the time raises for it to be called.

Now if you do have plays on your rules only thing else i can tell you is go thru your defense plays and UNCHECK the Nickel Strong FS CB3 Blitz then i think that should fix the issue.

it is like the time i had a rule for defense and that rule had a goal line attack 3 on it i basically had to go to the rule to remove the goal formation and put it on normal Defense yet it still was happening because it was selected .
So once i figured that i removed the play from my defense playbook and put it on different play that was not on the goal line formation but on the normal defense.

Re: Rules not working properly?

By punisher
9/27/2016 9:28 pm
btw if you do all that that i just said then i have no idea why it would still be happening to you.

Re: Rules not working properly?

By Nicko
9/27/2016 9:48 pm
punisher wrote:
what it might be is you dont have plays on those rules so thats why that Nickel Strong FS CB3 Blitz is popping up like it is .

if i remember correctly is once you make a RULE and go to the VIEW PLAYS for it it will tell you if you dont have a play for that rule it will select a play for that rule when the time raises for it to be called.

Now if you do have plays on your rules only thing else i can tell you is go thru your defense plays and UNCHECK the Nickel Strong FS CB3 Blitz then i think that should fix the issue.

it is like the time i had a rule for defense and that rule had a goal line attack 3 on it i basically had to go to the rule to remove the goal formation and put it on normal Defense yet it still was happening because it was selected .
So once i figured that i removed the play from my defense playbook and put it on different play that was not on the goal line formation but on the normal defense.


Thanks for the feedback.
I have checked the "view plays" button for all my rules and the play isn't included. For the time being I'm going to remove it from my playbook, but I would like to include it in the future if I can figure out why it's being called at weird times.

Re: Rules not working properly?

By punisher
9/28/2016 2:43 pm
Nicko wrote:

Thanks for the feedback.
I have checked the "view plays" button for all my rules and the play isn't included. For the time being I'm going to remove it from my playbook, but I would like to include it in the future if I can figure out why it's being called at weird times.


your welcome

well i guess you could look at the Defensive gameplan Text part

also maybe reason it might be happening is because that play is in NICKEL formation and your rule has nickel selected for what defense you want to run in that rule.

Re: Rules not working properly?

By Nicko
11/02/2016 5:12 pm
Ok, after this same scenario has happened to me multiple times, I think I've solved what the problem is.

*So I thought(and perhaps most of the other players here) that when you create a rule, it's "isolated" as it's own rule. That is not the case. When rules overlap, they combine the percentages into one rule. This can lead to plays being called that do NOT show up in the "view plays" preview. This is very confusing and messes up rules significantly. I think this should be changed so that each rule acts independently from others.

Here's an example for anyone that's confused.
So hypothetically let's say:
-You have a defensive rule that says when the offense is in 21 personnel you call Base 4-3 personnel, 100% 3 deep zone, 100% zone linebackers.
[The view plays button, only shows one play "3 deep zone under"]

-You have another rule(for the same part of the field) that says when the offense is in 21 personnel you call Base 4-3 personnel, 100% man, 100% Blitz 2 linebackers.
[The view plays button, only shows one play "OLB Blitz Outside"]

Logically, this should result in 50% of the time you call OLB Blitz Outside and 50% of the time you call 3 deep zone under. Right? Nope.

If you had the play "Man OLB Zone" active in your playbook(which is a man/zone linebackers play), that would be called 1/3 of the time! Because when rules overlap they combine into one. This example would be {50% Man/50% 3 Deep zone} and {50% zone/ 50% Blitz 2}. Which depending on your active plays, could result in many plays being called that do not show up in the "view plays" button.

Under most circumstances no one would notice anything, but my rules get pretty complicated and this has resulted in plays being called that I would NEVER have called in some situations. It's hard already trying to get the right play called in the right situation, without having to check every rule and combine their percentages together to come up with the actual plays that will be called.

I recommend changing this so that each rule is independent and if rules overlap, just add the plays/odds in the "view plays" together, not the percentages/personnel. This would be much more intuitive. Or if this change is not acceptable, then change the "view plays" button to reflect the odds of all rules that overlap(this seems more complex than the previous suggestion though).

Thanks for your time and consideration.

Re: Rules not working properly?

By jdavidbakr - Site Admin
11/03/2016 9:56 am
Yeah, I do understand the confusion, but the problem is that unless the rules overlap exactly you may have different play sets within one rule. I.e, if you have one rule that covers the entire quarter for any score but an overlapping rule that only applies in the last 2 minutes when your are ahead by 3 or more and the offense comes out in a 5WR set, and a third rule that only applies in the first quarter when you are inside the 20 yard line and losing by at least a touchdown, how would the 'view plays' show for the first rule? Most of the time it would be the only one that fires, but there are other situations that it would have crazy mixes with other rules.

Maybe the solution would be to prioritize rules and the AI stops at the first rule it hits.

Re: Rules not working properly?

By Bryson10
11/03/2016 10:27 am
Or have the rules be grouped and easier to identify. It gets confusing going through the rules and trying to decipher them all the way they are now

Re: Rules not working properly?

By punisher
11/03/2016 10:32 am
Bryson10 wrote:
Or have the rules be grouped and easier to identify. It gets confusing going through the rules and trying to decipher them all the way they are now


also have it where if 2 RULES are going to overlap one another it tells you so so you can make corrections as needed

Re: Rules not working properly?

By parsh
11/03/2016 2:16 pm
Bryson10 wrote:
Or have the rules be grouped and easier to identify. It gets confusing going through the rules and trying to decipher them all the way they are now


Or eliminate rules and trust the dice ... LOL

(Keep in mind, I'm logged into my Gamblers team at this moment ;) )